catholic church decides that unborn fetus aren't people [Archive] - Straight Edge and Hardcore Message board

xsecx

12-12-2013, 08:46 AM

Contrary to the anti-abortion stance of the Catholic Church, lawyers for Catholic Health Initiatives, the nonprofit being sued, are arguing that unborn fetuses are not considered 'persons' under Colorado law, where the Wrongful Death Act only protects those born alive.
The catholic Health initiative is funded by and a part of the catholic church and makes its doctors adhere to catholic doctrine.
http://www.psmag.com/health/doctors-catholic-hospitals-barred-discussing-abortion-patients-71228/

xCrucialDudex

12-12-2013, 11:28 AM

when it keeps them from being sued, but not when they are trying to stop abortions.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2013/01/25/st_thomas_more_hospital_lawsuit_a_fetus_is_not_a_p erson_when_we_re_being.html

keep it classy guys.

hahaha how convenient, isn't it? ah, the church. what else can I say here...

Cubey

04-21-2015, 03:41 PM

If women don't want to get pregnant then they need to quit being sluts. It's not rocket science. Unprotected sex tends to cause babies. Don't be a slut having unprotected sex with people you don't care much about and you won't need an abortion. Problem solved. Yes it's partly the man's fault, BUT it's mostly on the burden of the WOMAN to protect herself because it's HER BODY AND SHE IS THE ONE AT RISK FOR PREGNANCY.

They shouldn't have it both ways: Blaming the man for having sex when SHE is the one who is at risk of pregnancy but then allowing full choice on the part of the woman when she ends up pregnant. What about father's rights? They don't exist when abortion comes into play. It's neo-fascist feminist bullshit to the extreme.

rodrigo

04-21-2015, 09:22 PM

wow

xsecx

04-22-2015, 09:37 PM

Lifestyle_X

04-23-2015, 03:40 PM

Still, thanks for keeping the board alive. X true love X!

One-Eyed Firefly

05-12-2015, 08:16 PM

Abortion is a tough pill to swallow. I don't agree with the irresponsibility of a man impregnating a woman without her consent, and costing a child their life. It still happens. Also, I don't agree with women who are pregnant from rapes or sexual abuse being forced to keep that child, the spawn of the assailant. Ultimately, I believe in abortion for good reason, but that's not always the case and some women use it as a last ditch effort to shirk consequences. Hard to blame on such a colorful issue.

xsecx

05-13-2015, 10:25 AM

One-Eyed Firefly

05-13-2015, 12:34 PM

Who gets to decide what a good reason is? How is someone admitting that they aren't in a position to have and/or raise a kid shirking consequences from an unintended pregnancy?

My statement merely was to say that if legislation ever defines the rights of abortion beyond when it is alive, then it would probably look at reason (misc. cause for abortion by mother/family), environment, and finances. Shirking consequences are what abortion is all about. A consequences of impetuous or unprotected sex. Does a woman have the right to choice? I think so. What can we actually do to deter a woman if she wants to illegally remove that babe from her womb?

I never agreed with abortion growing up until one of my girlfriends aborted my child. Her reason, "I think the baby is evil." Which afterwards, I was relieved she never had my child and subjected it to years of mental abuse from her perceived threat of the child's morality. All of this points to was a psychological issue with her, and perhaps other women who share the same mindset. The aforementioned reason of my child, "being evil", not being a good enough one to kill a child still, in my mind. To consider it, would it be right to raise a child in a home where nobody wants them at the alternative of its life? Possibly.

However, financial standing MAY be sufficient reason to abort a child. (Or is it? Giving children up for adoption is a great choice, but many women who don't want to ruin their body would rather cost the life of the unborn. There is always a reason, who decides? Right now, the mom.) Even still, there are lots of government programs in America that help with raising a child and affording the bills, and help with birth control. Like Planned Parenthood, CHIP, WIC, CCS, etc. Me and my wife would never have been able to afford the Hospital costs of having children. No chance.

There is a flip-side. It is known that some fetuses are harvested for organs and skin to save other children or use as skin grafts to cancer victims. Abortion is a tough cookie to bite into, but it has some sweet spots. Which few admit to.

(Edit: In a perfect world, there would be no abortion.)

Cubey

11-16-2015, 05:49 AM

you've got issues.

Yes, I have issues with the way stupid people are running the world.

Cubey

11-16-2015, 05:53 AM

I never agreed with abortion growing up until one of my girlfriends aborted my child. Her reason, "I think the baby is evil." Which afterwards, I was relieved she never had my child and subjected it to years of mental abuse from her perceived threat of the child's morality. All of this points to was a psychological issue with her, and perhaps other women who share the same mindset. The aforementioned reason of my child, "being evil", not being a good enough one to kill a child still, in my mind. To consider it, would it be right to raise a child in a home where nobody wants them at the alternative of its life? Possibly.

Following that logic, you would have to agree that it's better for a psychotic parent to kill their child than for the child to be exposed to the parent. Such people end up killing the child.... but at least then they actually have to suffer for it, life in jail usually. Killing is killing, no matter when it's done age wise.

Abortion is borderline Nazi-like thinking. Purifying the race by killing the weak and those who might not do well. Keep in mind, the likes of Einstein and Edison did poorly in school and were probably looked upon as having no success in life. It's frightening to think that you and others are ok with potentially aborting the next brilliant mind of our time for the sake of a slut of a mother.

xsecx

11-16-2015, 07:55 AM

Following that logic, you would have to agree that it's better for a psychotic parent to kill their child than for the child to be exposed to the parent. Such people end up killing the child.... but at least then they actually have to suffer for it, life in jail usually. Killing is killing, no matter when it's done age wise.

Abortion is borderline Nazi-like thinking. Purifying the race by killing the weak and those who might not do well. Keep in mind, the likes of Einstein and Edison did poorly in school and were probably looked upon as having no success in life. It's frightening to think that you and others are ok with potentially aborting the next brilliant mind of our time for the sake of a slut of a mother.
how many kids have you adopted? What do you think should happen to all of those unwanted kids? What about the ruined lives of the women that are forced to carry them because you think they should? Are you also against birth control?

xsecx

11-16-2015, 07:56 AM

Yes, I have issues with the way stupid people are running the world.

no dude, you're a misogynist.

Cubey

11-17-2015, 04:25 PM

how many kids have you adopted? What do you think should happen to all of those unwanted kids? What about the ruined lives of the women that are forced to carry them because you think they should? Are you also against birth control?

None, but then again I'm a disabled single guy who's on food stamps. But that's besides the point. I would if I was in a position to be able to, but I'm not.

And anyway, orphans don't occur (just) from births of unwanted children. My mom and her brothers and sister ended up orphans due to a series of deaths in the family.

Maybe a woman shouldn't have have unprotected sex with men they don't give a shit about if they didn't want to "ruin their lives". Actions have consequences. A fraction of one percent of abortions are a result of rape. Mostly it's sluts who won't say no to the first douche bag they come across. It's mostly loose women (and men, to give fair blame). But like I said, men don't get pregnant. The burden is truly on the woman not to get pregnant no matter how much you want to say otherwise. If you want to say it's a "woman's choice" to have an abortion, the burden should be on HER not to NEED ONE in the first place. TO say otherwise is anti-woman in fact. Up until the point of abortion, you act like she's helpless and it's all the big bad man's fault. "Boohoo, the poor weaker sex couldn't help herself, it's the MAN'S fault!" Sorry, they doesn't fly. You can't have it both ways without being a hypocrite.

No, I'm not against birth control. "Prevention is the best medicine", as the old saying goes.

Cubey

11-17-2015, 04:43 PM

no dude, you're a misogynist.

I wasn't talking about woman specifically with that statement, so no. I'm not. Throwing that word around when it doesn't apply is similar to calling someone "fascist".

Men AND woman can be sluts. I have equal disdain for both sexes when it comes to stupid behavior. But that still doesn't excuse the woman from being the one who's ultimately responsible for allowing herself to get pregnant.

You claim to support "women's reproductive rights" but you seem to only think she's intelligent enough to make the right choice when it comes to abortions, not about sexual health/birth prevention. If anything, YOU are the misogynist. You think women are weak and stupid until they need an abortion, then you think they are suddenly brilliant.

xsecx

11-18-2015, 12:08 PM

None, but then again I'm a disabled single guy who's on food stamps. But that's besides the point. I would if I was in a position to be able to, but I'm not.

And anyway, orphans don't occur (just) from births of unwanted children. My mom and her brothers and sister ended up orphans due to a series of deaths in the family.

Maybe a woman shouldn't have have unprotected sex with men they don't give a shit about if they didn't want to "ruin their lives". Actions have consequences. A fraction of one percent of abortions are a result of rape. Mostly it's sluts who won't say no to the first douche bag they come across. It's mostly loose women (and men, to give fair blame). But like I said, men don't get pregnant. The burden is truly on the woman not to get pregnant no matter how much you want to say otherwise. If you want to say it's a "woman's choice" to have an abortion, the burden should be on HER not to NEED ONE in the first place. TO say otherwise is anti-woman in fact. Up until the point of abortion, you act like she's helpless and it's all the big bad man's fault. "Boohoo, the poor weaker sex couldn't help herself, it's the MAN'S fault!" Sorry, they doesn't fly. You can't have it both ways without being a hypocrite.

No, I'm not against birth control. "Prevention is the best medicine", as the old saying goes. you do realize that for all kinds of reasons that birth control fails right? That nothing short of abstinence is 100%. yet you call women sluts for that? Holy shit do you have a fucked up world view and or no real life experience or both.

xsecx

11-18-2015, 12:09 PM

I wasn't talking about woman specifically with that statement, so no. I'm not. Throwing that word around when it doesn't apply is similar to calling someone "fascist".

Men AND woman can be sluts. I have equal disdain for both sexes when it comes to stupid behavior. But that still doesn't excuse the woman from being the one who's ultimately responsible for allowing herself to get pregnant.

You claim to support "women's reproductive rights" but you seem to only think she's intelligent enough to make the right choice when it comes to abortions, not about sexual health/birth prevention. If anything, YOU are the misogynist. You think women are weak and stupid until they need an abortion, then you think they are suddenly brilliant.
uh huh. it completely applies. the language you choose makes that super clear.

Cubey

11-18-2015, 07:32 PM

you do realize that for all kinds of reasons that birth control fails right? That nothing short of abstinence is 100%. yet you call women sluts for that? Holy shit do you have a fucked up world view and or no real life experience or both.

Like I said, don't have hetero sex if you don't want to reproduce.

Or go get "fixed" like you do to your cat or dog when you don't want them popping out young'ins every time you turn your head. (This applies to both men and women)

My world view is fine. People are just stupid when it comes to bloody obvious things.

The easier access you make to anything, the more people will use/abuse it.

Cubey

11-18-2015, 07:37 PM

uh huh. it completely applies. the language you choose makes that super clear.

My "language" said "people", not "women", therefore it applied to both sexes. Try to pay attention...

xsecx

11-19-2015, 11:24 AM

My "language" said "people", not "women", therefore it applied to both sexes. Try to pay attention... I'm paying attention and the language you're using is straight up misogyny. You try and cover this by backtracking and saying "men can be sluts too" but you're all about punishing those sluts for having unprotected sex.

xsecx

11-19-2015, 11:26 AM

Like I said, don't have hetero sex if you don't want to reproduce.

Or go get "fixed" like you do to your cat or dog when you don't want them popping out young'ins every time you turn your head. (This applies to both men and women)

My world view is fine. People are just stupid when it comes to bloody obvious things.

The easier access you make to anything, the more people will use/abuse it.

have you ever been in an adult relationship? Are you saying that unless my wife and I want to have a kid, we shouldn't have sex? How the fuck does that make any kind of sense?

Cubey

11-19-2015, 02:17 PM

have you ever been in an adult relationship? Are you saying that unless my wife and I want to have a kid, we shouldn't have sex? How the fuck does that make any kind of sense?

Yes, I have, though that's not really any of your business.

It makes a world of sense. Besides, if you're THAT scared of reproducing though, how can you even stand to have sex? You'd be fearful the entire damn time.

Use birth control on BOTH sides (the pill+condoms). It's 99% effective. If by a 1% chance your wife gets pregnant, maybe it's meant to be. Not everything that seems bad at first is, you know.

Cubey

11-19-2015, 02:18 PM

I'm paying attention and the language you're using is straight up misogyny. You try and cover this by backtracking and saying "men can be sluts too" but you're all about punishing those sluts for having unprotected sex.

Whatever. I don't indulge people who selectively read and argue against mere sentence fragments I said. I'm done here.

xsecx

11-19-2015, 02:31 PM

Whatever. I don't indulge people who selectively read and argue against mere sentence fragments I said. I'm done here.

"If women don't want to get pregnant then they need to quit being sluts. It's not rocket science. Unprotected sex tends to cause babies. Don't be a slut having unprotected sex with people you don't care much about and you won't need an abortion. Problem solved. Yes it's partly the man's fault, BUT it's mostly on the burden of the WOMAN to protect herself because it's HER BODY AND SHE IS THE ONE AT RISK FOR PREGNANCY.

They shouldn't have it both ways: Blaming the man for having sex when SHE is the one who is at risk of pregnancy but then allowing full choice on the part of the woman when she ends up pregnant. What about father's rights? They don't exist when abortion comes into play. It's neo-fascist feminist bullshit to the extreme."

I read exactly what you said, all of it was full of anger towards women.

xsecx

11-19-2015, 02:35 PM

Yes, I have, though that's not really any of your business.

It makes a world of sense. Besides, if you're THAT scared of reproducing though, how can you even stand to have sex? You'd be fearful the entire damn time.

Use birth control on BOTH sides (the pill+condoms). It's 99% effective. If by a 1% chance your wife gets pregnant, maybe it's meant to be. Not everything that seems bad at first is, you know.

There's a difference between being scared of reproducing and not wanting a child for whatever reason. That doesn't mean that intimacy should be sacrificed because you have a fucked up relationship with sex. Thankfully though, your opinion doesn't really hold any sway. People are going to keep doing what they're doing. They're going to use birth control and they're gonna get abortions for pregnancies that weren't planned. That doesn't make people sluts, or irresponsible. It does make you angry that it happens, which says more about you than it does anything else.

Cubey

11-20-2015, 05:33 AM

People are going to keep doing what they're doing.

Yes. Stupid people.

xsecx

11-20-2015, 10:43 AM

Yes. Stupid people.

you mean everyone else, but you?

Cubey

01-18-2016, 09:55 PM

you mean everyone else, but you?

To an extent, yes.

Seeing as how almost everyone I know comes to me with their problems, clearly I'm at least somewhat more intelligent than them. Bloody obvious solutions to their problems never occurred to them, or they are too lazy to do it and expect me to it for them.

At least one individual who seems to be a drug addict (not sure why he's allowed to continue to live in the apt building) who can't seem to take a hint that I hate him (even when I said so one day, though somewhat indirectly) even comes to my door bugging me for help. I need to quit being nice and answering the door, I guess.

Hell, one of my neighbors even said to me "You really have your shit together.". And I do.

xsecx

01-18-2016, 10:24 PM

To an extent, yes.

Seeing as how almost everyone I know comes to me with their problems, clearly I'm at least somewhat more intelligent than them. Bloody obvious solutions to their problems never occurred to them, or they are too lazy to do it and expect me to it for them.

At least one individual who seems to be a drug addict (not sure why he's allowed to continue to live in the apt building) who can't seem to take a hint that I hate him (even when I said so one day, though somewhat indirectly) even comes to my door bugging me for help. I need to quit being nice and answering the door, I guess.

Hell, one of my neighbors even said to me "You really have your shit together.". And I do.
so you're a disabled guy on food stamps, but you're super smart and better than everyone else? It doesn't really sound like you're all the qualified/capable of making the judgements on others that you do, but that might just be the point.

Cubey

01-30-2016, 09:51 PM

so you're a disabled guy on food stamps, but you're super smart and better than everyone else? It doesn't really sound like you're all the qualified/capable of making the judgements on others that you do, but that might just be the point.

Actually, I am in a better position to evaluate and make judgements upon what I witness. I study and dwell on subjects more than the average person. Most people are too busy to give a damn about anything except themselves. They live in a bubble where the only thing that matters is themselves.

People wonder how I can know so much about any given subject I begin to talk about. It's because I don't have to waste time and energy on providing my basic needs. I can devote all of my time to learning.

So yes, I am in a better position to make such assumptions out of my full time, scholastic way of life.

rodrigo

01-31-2016, 08:29 AM

People wonder how I can know so much about any given subject I begin to talk about. It's because I don't have to waste time and energy on providing my basic needs. I can devote all of my time to learning.

dude, no disrespect, but that was hilarious.

xsecx

01-31-2016, 11:51 AM

Actually, I am in a better position to evaluate and make judgements upon what I witness. I study and dwell on subjects more than the average person. Most people are too busy to give a damn about anything except themselves. They live in a bubble where the only thing that matters is themselves.

People wonder how I can know so much about any given subject I begin to talk about. It's because I don't have to waste time and energy on providing my basic needs. I can devote all of my time to learning.

So yes, I am in a better position to make such assumptions out of my full time, scholastic way of life.

so somehow by not living life, you're somehow more qualified to tell other people how to live theirs? And by studying do you mean in college, or just sitting around reading the internet?

Cubey

02-07-2016, 06:57 PM

dude, no disrespect, but that was hilarious.

It's a basic socioeconomic fact. If you aren't stressing about your next meal or keeping a roof over your head in the form of working, you are free to peruse other avenues in life. It's one of the arguments in factor of "basic income".

Ask most anyone on the street if they follow politics or know pretty much anything about anything outside of their bubble of pop culture, sound bites from the so-called "news" and their job and they will most likely say "I'm too busy". People who work for a living (as in, 1 full time or 2-3 part time due to the effed up job market) don't generally don't have the time to sit down and learn about things that aren't relevant to keeping their finances flowing or what caters to their entertainment desires.

Cubey

02-07-2016, 07:01 PM

so somehow by not living life, you're somehow more qualified to tell other people how to live theirs? And by studying do you mean in college, or just sitting around reading the internet?

You know know that probably 2/3 of info online IS real, if not even 3/4. The source your information cines from is what counts. I read a ton about history online as well as in old (pre-1950) books. History gets glazed over the further from the event occurring. Just look at the legacies of Reagan and Dubya. Despite both being horrid, they have already been glazed over heavily by propaganda to make them seem less horrible for when history books get written about them in 50-100 yearsl, as well as the short term in the form of elections.

xsecx

02-08-2016, 09:12 AM

You know know that probably 2/3 of info online IS real, if not even 3/4. The source your information cines from is what counts. I read a ton about history online as well as in old (pre-1950) books. History gets glazed over the further from the event occurring. Just look at the legacies of Reagan and Dubya. Despite both being horrid, they have already been glazed over heavily by propaganda to make them seem less horrible for when history books get written about them in 50-100 yearsl, as well as the short term in the form of elections.

History isn't valuable in a vacuum. It has to be augmented and viewed through the eyes of experience. By all accounts you're not really living. You're reading stuff, thinking yourself superior but not actually experiencing life. Reading about life, isn't live, and certainly doesn't give you any insight on how to tell other people how to live their lives when you aren't even living yours.

elize21

02-09-2016, 02:38 AM

I guess he live his life differently from most people.

mouseman004

02-10-2016, 01:58 PM

It's a basic socioeconomic fact. If you aren't stressing about your next meal or keeping a roof over your head in the form of working, you are free to peruse other avenues in life. It's one of the arguments in factor of "basic income".

Ask most anyone on the street if they follow politics or know pretty much anything about anything outside of their bubble of pop culture, sound bites from the so-called "news" and their job and they will most likely say "I'm too busy". People who work for a living (as in, 1 full time or 2-3 part time due to the effed up job market) don't generally don't have the time to sit down and learn about things that aren't relevant to keeping their finances flowing or what caters to their entertainment desires.

It is insane to me how delusional you are. If you have so much time to spend "learning" maybe somewhere in your reading you could have learned that when you end a sentence with a quotation, the period goes before the final quotation mark. Normally I am not petty enough to pick on someone's grammar, but when you're talking shit about how much smarter you are than everybody else because you're unemployed, it seemed fitting to point out what you apparently don't know.

Also, if you honestly believe that everybody who works for a living thinks only about money and are not open to learning new things, I pity the lives of the people around you who led you to that asinine assumption.

Cubey

03-06-2016, 10:16 PM

Nitpicking an improperly placed period? You REALLY had to grasp at straws to try to discredit me. I never claimed to be the god of grammar/punctuation so I'm not sure why you thought that would offend me. Oh well, nice try but you failed.

It is insane to me how delusional you are.

You are wrong. I know what I am and that's all there is to it. No one can know myself better than I. End of discussion.

Lifestyle_X

03-07-2016, 03:05 AM

I don't think you get the "point", dude.

mouseman004

03-14-2016, 08:31 AM

Nitpicking an improperly placed period? You REALLY had to grasp at straws to try to discredit me. I never claimed to be the god of grammar/punctuation so I'm not sure why you thought that would offend me. Oh well, nice try but you failed.

You are wrong. I know what I am and that's all there is to it. No one can know myself better than I. End of discussion.

It wasn't grasping at straws, it was making a point that you obviously missed. You're apparently smarter than everybody else who works for a living though, so you'll eventually get it.